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  • #1

    SC's Motion Offense

    Coming off a crazy month where I ran or hiked 442 miles, I didn't have much time to post...

    Last night's game was fun, but I'm a little worried about the mental ramifications of such a blowout win. We played pretty well (especially on D), but it by no means was it perfect. I hope the team looks at the game critically.

    During the Utah loss (almost unwatchable game), I was bothered by the predictability of (mostly Evan) pulling himself all the way to the top of the key to set a screen. It was (and really has been) predictable, and I haven't seen any direct scoring outcome from it - I know it is also part of the offensive progression, but there's so much opportunity here: a pick and roll, or Evan can fake the screen and slide into the key (defender is understandably overplaying the screen every time), Evan can demand the ball at the high post instead of setting the pick, face up and either stroke his pretty mid-range jumper or dump it to an open teammate. But we're just doing that same top-of-the-key pick every time. Tahj doesn't even really need it.

    We've also abandoned the high/low to a degree. There were a couple of games early in the season when Evan & Isaiah worked that to perfection. Would love to see that going. Chevez also had some nice passes from the high post in the past as well.

    Final criticism after a rosy outcome yesterday: Petersen and Evan and probably Max, too, have a tendency to face their backs to the basket when they're not in the post - often times they pick up their dribble as well. This has frustrated me many times and it frequently results in a turnover. Petersen does it under pressure a lot when he's 30 feet from the basket. I hope those guys minimize that. There's no passing or scoring options when your teammates and the rim are behind your head.

    ps - I wonder why our motion offense is always towards the ball and never pass and screen away. Just a curious observation.
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  • #2
    Great post and I have had some similar thoughts about our motion offense. We see what happened when the defense denied the post entry pass and denied the wing pass to start our offense (think Colorado). We don't have that dynamic PG that can break his man down and create. EA can do it sometimes and is getting better at it but he can be easily neutralized if a team just watches film on us. JMac was the best in recent years..
    • Likes 1

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    • #3
      Great points. I was going to mention something about what bothers me about the offense. Sure, everything looked great after the first 8 minutes but we just demoralized Stanford with our smothering defense.

      What bothers me is E. Mobley is set above the free throw line for many possessions. At times he will face up and try to take his man off the dribble right into help defense. If EM was Kevin Durant then having him above the free throw line to create would great but obviously he is not. When he is set in the high post there is no need to double him and spacing/ball movement suffers.

      Why he isn't in the low post more is a mystery to me. If we got the ball to him in the low post most teams would be forced to double. That would create better spacing and ball movement as EM has shown he is a willing passer.

      It just feels that once in tournament we are going to struggle to score unless we can force teams to double Evan.

      Comment

      • biggitysc
        #3.1
        biggitysc commented
        03-04-2021, 12:09 PM
        Editing a comment
        Part of me sees us struggling in the tournament to score and the other part I want to believe sees someone stepping up big and hitting outside shots. The offense seems to work best when they play through Evan and he works the low post or when he works the high post and passes the ball to another big inside.
    • #4
      Originally posted by ob4sc View Post
      Coming off a crazy month where I ran or hiked 442 miles, I didn't have much time to post...
      That's ridiculous! Sounds like you moved around enough for the rest of us. Keep up the good work! We'll all keep the couch warm for ya!

      Comment

      • ob4sc
        #4.1
        ob4sc commented
        03-04-2021, 02:44 PM
        Editing a comment
        Haha... yeah, call it my mid-life crisis. 50 years old, man! Did the calendar club challenge: Ran or hiked the number of miles as the day on the calendar. On the 28th, I ran from Culver City to SC and back, then down to Hennessey's in Hermosa. My wife met me and we had burgers and beer watching the sunset. Brutal.
    • #5
      Great post. I've observed and mentioned much of those things as well. Our motion sets are....well, what motion sets? We're predicated on Evan-centric concepts, but Evan can play anywhere, and running back screens and cuts sounds helpful to have in the playbook. ...especially when we've seen so many long stretches of trouble in half court sets. High low is missing, and was working well at one point. We don't use the high post very effectively anymore imo. The Mobleys were great in that capacity and have great chemistry. Ethan is the guy who picks up his dribble too much for me. Drew does it too, but not nearly as often imo. Ethan is religious about it. Our ball movement was better last night, although it was against a depleted, run-down farm.

      All great points. Keep those feet moving for the rest of us!

      ✌😎
      • Likes 1

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      • #6
        Originally posted by ob4sc View Post
        Coming off a crazy month where I ran or hiked 442 miles, I didn't have much time to post...

        Last night's game was fun, but I'm a little worried about the mental ramifications of such a blowout win. We played pretty well (especially on D), but it by no means was it perfect. I hope the team looks at the game critically.

        During the Utah loss (almost unwatchable game), I was bothered by the predictability of (mostly Evan) pulling himself all the way to the top of the key to set a screen. It was (and really has been) predictable, and I haven't seen any direct scoring outcome from it - I know it is also part of the offensive progression, but there's so much opportunity here: a pick and roll, or Evan can fake the screen and slide into the key (defender is understandably overplaying the screen every time), Evan can demand the ball at the high post instead of setting the pick, face up and either stroke his pretty mid-range jumper or dump it to an open teammate. But we're just doing that same top-of-the-key pick every time. Tahj doesn't even really need it.

        We've also abandoned the high/low to a degree. There were a couple of games early in the season when Evan & Isaiah worked that to perfection. Would love to see that going. Chevez also had some nice passes from the high post in the past as well.

        Final criticism after a rosy outcome yesterday: Petersen and Evan and probably Max, too, have a tendency to face their backs to the basket when they're not in the post - often times they pick up their dribble as well. This has frustrated me many times and it frequently results in a turnover. Petersen does it under pressure a lot when he's 30 feet from the basket. I hope those guys minimize that. There's no passing or scoring options when your teammates and the rim are behind your head.

        ps - I wonder why our motion offense is always towards the ball and never pass and screen away. Just a curious observation.
        Ucla will also come unto the game angry after losing to Oregon

        Comment

        • #7
          "Motion Offense" is a term of art. It's what Bobby Knight was famous for. Generally speaking, it's not what we run.

          Comment

          • #8
            Originally posted by swamdog View Post
            Great points. I was going to mention something about what bothers me about the offense. Sure, everything looked great after the first 8 minutes but we just demoralized Stanford with our smothering defense.

            What bothers me is E. Mobley is set above the free throw line for many possessions. At times he will face up and try to take his man off the dribble right into help defense. If EM was Kevin Durant then having him above the free throw line to create would great but obviously he is not. When he is set in the high post there is no need to double him and spacing/ball movement suffers.

            Why he isn't in the low post more is a mystery to me. If we got the ball to him in the low post most teams would be forced to double. That would create better spacing and ball movement as EM has shown he is a willing passer.

            It just feels that once in tournament we are going to struggle to score unless we can force teams to double Evan.
            Earlier in the season, they had him in the low post more but he got quickly doubled team and was ineffective at times. After the first Colorado game, I noticed they had him at the high post more to give him more room and to take advantage of his ball handling skills and take other bigs off of the dribble. His outside shot isn't reliable though and the defense will lag off a bit but I think this is still the best way to utilize his skills especially against physical bigs.
            Last edited by TroyD; 03-04-2021, 02:05 PM.
            • Likes 1

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            • swamdog
              #8.1
              swamdog commented
              03-04-2021, 02:47 PM
              Editing a comment
              Yeah, they did. I still look back the UCONN game where they ran at him with double teams all night and he passed out of them brilliantly. He could have had 10 to 12 assists in that game had we made a open jumper.
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